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jimshelley
20-01-2001, 21:09
hi RMC site users,
please would you as anglers ,view your opinions on this worrying subject ,are you for it or against it "THE SH.T WHICH PEOPLE ARE ENDORSING AS BRITISH ,NO WAY ARE THEM POXY DISEASE RIDDEN IMPORTS TAKING OUR HISTORY AWAY.I HOPE I HAVENT OVER STEPPED THE MARK ,IAN.
JIM SHELLEY
KEEPING IT TOTALLY BRITISH
P.S. CAN YOU GIVE POSITIVE VIEWS, NO SLAGGING PLEASE.

Rivercarper
20-01-2001, 21:28
I'm totally for the keep it real campaign Jim but convincing some people that any fish that was imported in the c1 to c4 year classes and then grown on in britian are classed as british as opposed to a fish that was imported at a very high weight and stocked in to some water are totally different is proving differcult with some people.
There are others who just don't want to know or don't care as long as the fish in the waters they are fish are huge.And they don't care what they pay to fish these waters either.Nore do the fishery owners who have created these instant big fish waters because they are making loads of money.There it is that dirty word that has caused the problem in the first place.

SAMR
20-01-2001, 21:30
I am completely against imports and it would be terrible if an import was accepted as a record. i personally think that more should be done by the carp society etc. to go and challenge the owners of the lakes that have been stocked by these imports.

I would hate to see mary replaced by an import as a british record and i've got a feeling that the same is going to happen to the carp record that what happened to the catfish record.

I also think that the weekly publications could do more to help the issue. They seem to be promoting imports as they show their photos right next to one of a british fish.

Also, i think that the number of 'name' anglers that fish for these carp is shameful as a kid only has to look in a mag at this angler and they would probobly assume that it was british as there is no notification about the nationality of these fish.

I think that the whole issue is really sad. And i would never get any satisfaction in catching an import.
KEEP IT REAL
SAM

By the way, alot of websites (not this one) are giving tips on how to fish these waters.

Rivercarper
20-01-2001, 21:34
Unfortunatley Sam neither the Carp Society or the Angling press will say anything.

jimshelley
20-01-2001, 21:49
hi rivercarper,
thats the problem with some of them ,any exclusive photos or story and there like voltures round a carcass ,no mater wot origions they are them ?.
cheers
jim shelley
keeping it british.

jimshelley
20-01-2001, 22:09
hi RMC anglers,
PLEASE DONT BLOW THIS THREAD ,LIKE IAN WELCH HAS SAID ,JUST GIVE POSITIVE VIEWS ON THIS TOPIC.
CHEERS
JIM SHELLEY
KEEPING IT BRITISH.

NODDY
20-01-2001, 22:17
JIM&RIVERCARPER.
what exactaly is a british carp?.
i know that a huge imported carp aint,but i have seen it mentioned about carp that have been stocked in the c1,c4 classes what does that mean??.
it seams that if you want the support of the majority of carp anglers you will need to explain what denotes a british carp.
i.e does it mean that any carp stocked legaly at say 1-10lb and then grows on to be a nice say 30lb carp,would this be a british carp,or are you saying that only fish spawned in england are british???.
to be quite blunt most of the terms being used are going right over the heads of ordenary carpers.

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by NODDY on 20/01/01 10:20 PM.</FONT></P>

NODDY
20-01-2001, 22:30
ian.
thanks for your reply,this has now made it more clear as to what british is and i can see where the keeping it real boys are comeing from.

Rivercarper
20-01-2001, 22:35
Thats it Jim the weeklies have got to fill their pages each week and the carp society won't say anything for fear off alienating some of their membership and or their supporters.Sorry Ian I know you are involved but the society dare not stir this subject up by getting involved(my view only).
Does the Society magazine carry adverts from some of the dubiously stocked waters.

jimshelley
20-01-2001, 23:12
hi,
it seems to me that alot of us ,using rmc angling are very united for this topic .
cheers
jim shelley
keeping it british.

DarrenWilson
20-01-2001, 23:14
You know TCL's (the team behind the site) stance on the topic Jim. Wait for the Rotary to come round to you Jim:)

100% and not just on the Band Wagon.

Darren Wilson
Co-Webmaster
The Carpers Lodge

jimshelley
20-01-2001, 23:29
hi darren,
you know iam behind anyone thats standing for the keeping it real banner.
cheers
jim shelley
keeping it british.

NODDY
20-01-2001, 23:32
JIM (may i call you jim??).
after ians reply i am begining to get my head round this issue.
but one or two things are still rolling around in my mind.
i can understand that a record carp when caught should have been stocked at say c1-c4 class thats fair i would say.
but and heres the rub are you setting out to denigrate the (for a better way of putting it) the normal carper that just likes to catch carp that may not have been stocked as above,and has no idea when the carp in the lake he is fishing were stocked or at what weight (this would i think apply to most carpers).
take my self,i fish sevaral lakes that contain what i would call large carp,30lb and above but i could not tell you when they were stocked or at what weights,but i belive that they would be classed as british.
hope that you can see what i am trying to say.

scorpio
20-01-2001, 23:40
Sorry Noddy mate I have to dissagree, the carp you are referring to have not taken days, months and sometimes years to catch, When a carp is imported and stocked into a water it is "green" and is relatively easy to catch in comparison to a carp that has been " brought up" in a British water. It takes a lot, and i mean a lot of skill, patience and dedications to catch a 30 year old British carp. Read the bit about the of the Carp caught by Alan Welch from the <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.rmcangling.co.uk/syndicate_venues/crayfish_pool.html>Crayfish pool (http://www.rmcangling.co.uk/news/pages.phtml?CAT=1&ID=117>latest) recently, check out the Angling Diary section and you may understand Jim's and a lot of other peoples views regarding the "KEEP IT BRITISH" vane on this forum.

Tony<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Billyo on 20/01/01 11:54 PM.</FONT></P>

jimshelley
20-01-2001, 23:53
hi noddy,
marys mate wot a fish 50 plus years old ,"no fish will take hes place "thats one on its own,this is wot its all about ,marys mate british history.NO JOKES ,YOU KNOW IT TO BE TRUE.
cheers jim shelley
keeping it totally british.

NODDY
21-01-2001, 00:05
hi scorpio.
how can you dissagree with a question??????.
because thats what i was doing asking a question.
if you look at my frofile you will see that i am not a newbee to carping.
as for you comment that an imported carp is green when first stocked,all i would ask is for how long is it going to be as you put it "green".
i also know and realise how mutch hard work goes into catching an old british carp (caught my share).
but my whole point was/is that most carpers do not know the stocking history of the lakes they fish,nor are they privee to the carp grapevine.
so my question is i feal still relevant i.e (and this is important to me)( before i deside what side of the fence as it were that i stand) is or does the keep it real campain set its self above or seperat to the (for a better phrase) common carp angler.

NODDY
21-01-2001, 00:17
hi jim.
yes mary and her mate are quite some fish.
can i cut through the bull****e as it were (hpoe the moderators let that past).
your good self and rivercarper and my self have been carping for quite a few years (to many the wife would say).
i my self have never to my knolage fished for large forin carp.
but my original question still stands.
does the keep it real campain and those that support it set then selves above the runn of the mill carper.
this is very important to me and i do need to know this.
if you would rather not post a reply PLEASE send me an email.
if you do send an e-mail i give you my word that it will be for my knolage only.

sallers
21-01-2001, 00:23
Hi Guy's

I am right behind the " KEEPING IT BRITISH" campaign and i'm sure this is what 99% of RMC members would feel, it's good to know that Ian is right behind this campaign. Can't wait to get some of the new clothing. Ian is there somewhere we can view this?

Symon

jimshelley
21-01-2001, 00:37
hi noddy,
theres no need to swear,so please keep it calm.no way do we stand above you , run of the mill anglers"carp",where only trying to help ,you understand wots going on. so please help us, run of the mill english carp anglers.
tight lines
jim shelley
keeping it totally british.

Billyo
21-01-2001, 00:46
For starters, take a look by clicking <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.rmcangling.co.uk/images/comp/keepitreal.JPG>HERE</A>... more to come soon.

If everyone is behind the 'Keeping It Real' campaign, get your photo's of British Fish in all the mags you can (wearing the 'Keeping It Real' logo)...

You could also write to your prefered mag and see if they dare publsh !!

Bill.

NODDY
21-01-2001, 00:51
jim.
i dont understand whats going on,thats the whole point of my asking the questions that i have.
all i seam to be getting is the run around,at no time has anyone spelt out just what the keeping it real campain stands for.other than the stopping of forgien imports,and a large imported carp being put up for the british record.
is this all that the keeping it real campain is about or is there something else i dont know????.

sallers
21-01-2001, 01:03
Billy,

Where can we get this merchandise from, I presume by phoning the main office am I right?

Symon

DanTheMan
21-01-2001, 01:08
noddy - nice to have you on board.
i am a 'run of the mill carp angler' , i fish when i can, as often as i can, but i have many other things in my life that are important. jim or ian i'm sure will tell me if i'm wrong, but to me keep it real simply means-dont ever let selfish, greedy people ruin something that we have and is special to us. dont line fishery owners pockets if they are stocking foreign carp into our lovely waters. if we do not support them, they will go out of business. support rmc, linear etc..and all the guys that want it to be kept special. i see your point about not knowing exactly what is in your water,where it came from etc.. but it cant be that hard to find out if your heart is really in it. if we pull together and be strong, then you know the things that are real will survive in the end.
good luck mate-full respect for voicing your opinion. be true to what yuo belive in.
Dan the Man
P.s. - i was drunk when i wrote this , so take it with a pinch, but the message is from the soul buddy!

NODDY
21-01-2001, 01:17
hi dan.
thanks alot for your reply and for a straight answer to my question.
if what you have said is what this keep it real campain is about then i can/have been supporting it for as long as i have been fishing in so much that i have never fished for large forien carp to my knolage.

Billyo
21-01-2001, 01:38
Symon,

Yes, you can get them by calling the office on: 01256 453 300 or emailing [email protected] they will be on the site soon with more photo's...

Bill.

DanTheMan
21-01-2001, 01:46
noddy- glad to be of some help mate. keep flying the flag mate,and be lucky in all your fishing. i'm gonna need it on the river thames tom. how cold is it??????
Dan

jimshelley
21-01-2001, 02:03
HI NODDY,
come and have a guest session down fen ,i will show you wots its all about mate
cheers
jim shlley.
keeping it british.

NODDY
21-01-2001, 02:30
HI JIM.
thanks for the invite and i may just hold you to it when the weather warms up a bit (getting old) where is the fen located???.

jimshelley
21-01-2001, 08:27
hi,
CAMBRIDGESHIRE.
JIM SHELLEY
KEEPING IT BRITISH.

alex
21-01-2001, 11:03
I like what is being said and I'm sure you have already taken into account what I am about to say carp were imported to this country in the first place they were never native to this country if I'm not mistaken I think it was the Romans who introduced them to this country so the way I look at it is carp have been coming into this country for decades but I agree some of the fish being imported carry virus's but so do the fish in this country and every other country for that matter but I am for your ideas.
Keep up the good work.
Alex.
PS. if you have a problem with what I have said you can write to me using the personal messaging service.

ian
21-01-2001, 11:49
jim , everyone with a rmc card is helping to keep it real ,ie fishing for english carp and bringing funds to buy and breed english carp alot is down to ian ,as a long as hes the boss rmc will remain and stand for english carp ,you are probaly talking to the converted as with big carp mag its the other mags readers that need converting , the only good bit in cw is jenkins articule and the same for cash in ct ,keep up the good work ,marys mate an ex bedfont fish maybe now they are stunners.keeping it real ian

scorpio
21-01-2001, 12:08
Noddy,

Sorry, I mis-understood your post, my opinion would probably be different from some but..... you are right by saying anglers may not know what is stocked in a lake, the question you need to ask yourself is.. "<font color=blue>if you caught a 60lb carp and knew it was an import would you enter it for the British record"</font color=blue>. From my trout fishing I know that the longer a fish has been in a water the more difficult it is to catch and this goes for Carp or any other speicies for that matter. The point I was making you already do agree with, catching a British carp which has been living in our waters is much more rewarding than catching an import. For most people it is anyway.

Tony

CarponlineEditor
21-01-2001, 13:53
Personally if I caught a huge fish of like you said say 60lbs and I found out it was from abroad then I would not want to make any type of claim let alone the british record. The only thing that may get me into trouble here is that, if say I caught a huge fish from the Thames, say over forty pounds, then I would be well chuffed with it, but there is a chance that it came from abroad. However as I wouldnt know if it had or had not come from abroad I would still be well chuffed with it if a little dubious.

Can I add to this thread by asking you all why you are all against the foreign imports? I know that one of my reasons is that of the risk of disease and with this goes the threat of killing our own native stocks, so this is a very bad thing. Also I dont as has been mentioned before, like the idea of a fish of huge proportions getting hold of the british record of it came from abroad at a huge weight and was dropped into a lake over here.

What I dont understand however is the fact that some of us will slag off anglers who just dont know whether the fish they are after are foreign or not. I agree that if someone in the know like some of us who have been after carp for years keep putting their pictures in the magazines and they are all imported fish then this should maybe be stopped but when matey from down the road goes to his local day ticket fishery and catches what to him is the fish of a lifetime and aqll he honestly knows is that it came from the water that he was fishing then I dont think that he should be slagged off.

If you go to a water and you see someone who really doesnt know any better fishing with a dodgy rig, you would try to educate them would you not? You wouldnt walk right up to him and tell him off, at least I hope you wouldnt. The thing to do is to try toeducate these anglers so that then maybe they would fish waters that dont have foreign imports in.

I will be honest here and tell you that apart from one complex that I have heard holds foreign fish that have been imported at large weights, I couldnt tell you where not to fish because of this. Is there a list anywhere that says where has been stocked like this? I dont think it helps much when some of us say 'you know where they are' cos some of us dont.

Anyway been waffling again lol

Andy

scorpio
21-01-2001, 14:12
Andy,

The danger here is to prove that the fisheries are using imports, a lot of anglers know there are imports in the lakes but have no proof. If people start acusations there could be cause for libal etc.

As you say, no angler is any worse or better than another in the respect to what they fish for, it is the individual's choice.

At RMC anglers fish these waters for the carp because it is their choice to catch British fish. The thing that get's anglers irate in my view is anglers fishing for foriegn imports and claiming a spot in Carp fishing history. For example, when Jim Shelley caught Mary say for instance a 60lb fish was caught the same week which had been caught by someone just turning up at a water and getting lucky because the fish was green and hadn't been caught before, Jim would had been put to the back pages of the weeklies where the 60 would have been all over the place. We have to give credit where it is due. I think this is a major factor in the "keeping it real" slogan. This is just my opinion and I am not a Carp angler but if I was in that position I would not be happy to say the least.

Tony

CarponlineEditor
21-01-2001, 14:28
I entirely agree with the point that you are making here. What I am not so happy to accept is the fact that the chap who caught the 60 may have not had a clue as to where the carp had originally come from, so we shouldnt neccessarily have a go at him. It should be the fisheries themselves that get the arguments. As I mentioned before there are anglers who are in the know and they should not be doing this. I just reckon that if my past experience of seeing how some of these unexperienced anglers fish is anything to go by then we should be educating them and not telling them off.

I know that this is not part of the original argument but I still think that it is important not to have anglers against the 'Keep it real' ideal just because they didnt understand it before it was explained to them. There are many anglers who dont have access to the internet and the like so they will not be as aware of the issue as others are. As has been mentioned before the magazines are not going to neccessarily get on the band wagon as their sales and litigations are dependant on not alienating anyone.

I totally agree with the 'Keep it real' campaign, I am just not sure we should have a go at anglers who may not know any better.

Andy

davidc978
21-01-2001, 15:26
Hi Jim,

You get on here as well. Keep it British all the way.

NODDY
21-01-2001, 17:13
HI SCORPIO.
THATS ALRIGHT MATE, IN ANSWER TO YOU QUESTION ABOUT A 60LB CARP (IMPORT) NO IT SHOULD NOT BE PUT UP AS A BRITISH RECORD.
AS TO SOME CARPERS NOT KNOWING WERE THE CARP IN THE LAKES THEY FISH COME FROM LET ME TELL YOU AND THE REST OF THE POSTERS HERE A LITTLE STORY.
ABOUT 2 YEARS AGO I WAS FISHING AT A LAKE THAT I HAD BEEN FISHING FOR A COUPLE OF SEASONS AND HAD GOT TO KNOW THE OWNER QUITE WELL.
THEN ONE DAY WHILE I WAS FISHING HE CAME OVER AND ASKED IF I COULD HELP STOCK SOME FISH SO I REELED IN AND WALKED BACK AROUND THE LAKE WITH HIM.
AND AT THE OTHER SIDE OF THE LAKE WAS A LAND ROVER WITH A BIG STEEL FISH TANK HOOKED UP TO IT,IT EVEN HAD OXIGEN BOTTLES PUTTING AIR INTO THE TANK.
AND IN THE TANK WERE SOME BIG CARP IF I REMEMBER RIGHT THERE WAS 5X20LB,4X30LB,AND ONE AT 43LB.
SO THEY WERE DUELY PUT INTO SAID LAKE (I NEVER HAVE CAUGHT A 40LB CARP) BUT JUST HOLDING IT WAS A BUZZ.
I DID ASK WHERE THE CARP HAD COME FROM AND WAS TO THAT A PRIVATE LAKE IN SUSSEX HAD CLOSED AND THAT HE HAD BOUGHT THE FISH FROM THERE.
SO HOW WOULD I OR ANYONE ESLSE KNOW ANY DIFFERENT.
HOPE YOU ALL CAN SEE WHAT I AM TRYING TO EXPLAIN.

scorpio
21-01-2001, 17:50
I fully understand what you are saying and do agree if you do not know where the fish stocks originate from you don't know if the fish in the said water are British. As for the story of the fished stocked at the water you described, to be honest if a fishery held these fish I am sure there would have been some news about it's closure. In the case you are quoting and in your position I would have most certainly done some homework to clarify the situation.

You are right by what you say, there isn't any way by looking at a fish and telling for sure if it's British. For example there was a large carp caught not so long back and all that was missing were the onions and beret but this was a British fish. Looked foreign yes, but a definate Brit.

What I think the "keep it real" boys are concerned about are anglers dispalying fish that are known to have come from a water that holds imports and gaining from their capture.

Who knows if imported fish are easier to catch than British fish, I would say the longer a fish has been in a water be it a British or foreign import the harder it is to catch.

Personally speaking, I would sooner catch an uncaught wild British carp at 20lbs than a fish named and caught on many occasions at 40lb. Once again this is my personal choice.

Tony

NODDY
21-01-2001, 18:07
SCORPIO.
I THINK WE ARE BOTH ON THE SAME WAVE LENGHT ON THIS SUBJECT.
BUT I DO THINK THAT THE ANGLING MAGS DO HAVE A LOT TO ANSWER FOR AS THEY DO SEAM TO ONLY SHOW PICTURES OF BIG CARP.
AND TO NEW COMERS TO CARP FISHING IT MUST LOOK LIKE SIZE IS EVERY THING,DONT YOU THINK IT WOULD BE NICE IF THEY (THE MAGS) HAD A SECTION IN THEM WHERE YOUNG CARPERS COULD SEND IN THEIR PHOTOS OF SAY THEIR FIRST CARP,IT WOULD BE ONE WAY OF SHOWING THAT SIZE IS NOT THE BE ALL OF CARPING.
BUT I DOUT IF IT WILL HAPPEN AS PICTURES OF BIG CARP SELL MAGS.

SAMR
21-01-2001, 18:07
i would say that if a fish has just been moved into a water from a water that it has been in for a long time would get caught fairly easily because it would be all confused and wouldn't know where everything was so it would loose all caution when picking up boilies etc. i would say this would happen for english and foreign fish.
Keeping it very real
SAM

alex
21-01-2001, 18:59
Andy made some very good points and I have the same opinons about these fish does it really matter if someone does catch a import okay if there was a 60lb carp which you know is an import you should make people aware of this fish because like Andy said some of us younger and newer anglers don't know what a imported fish looks like and if the angling magazines are made aware of these potential record fish then when someone else catches this carp and sends pictures into magazines they will know and then the spotlight won't be taken away from the real record fish like Mary.
But the next thing that is bothering me is we go to other countries and fish for these fish because of their size and they are easy to catch but when they are put in our waters you don't want to fish for them. The next big thing I want to get off of my chest is about people making acuseations about waters containing imports because so many people are against them it can destroy a lakes and business people work hard to build up a good lake and then someone starts a rumor about imported fish in the lake it not only kills the fishing but it destroys somthing people have spent there life working for so I do ask yet agian that people are careful about what they say just think what rumor can do to a lake owners life if their business is destroyed not so long ago on this site people said things about Whitevane and people started talking and it just got worse and worse now I know the people who said it did not mean to start anything but it can lead to ending peoples careers.
Alex.
PS. If anyone has a problem with anything I have said please use the personal messaging service to have ago at me. /images/forum/icons/smile.gif

Dan
21-01-2001, 19:37
behind it all the way.. 100% British

cheers
Dan

bazza
21-01-2001, 20:24
keeping it british? what is the view about a carp reared in N.Ireland beyond c4 age, brought overseas and imported into a water? it is technically british, but i would imagine it wouldn't be readily accepted...

this 'keep it real' attitude is very commendable, and a sentiment i fully agree with, but like ian vallintine has said, aren't we preaching to the converted? everyone on this site would agree that imported carp are NOT what we want to fish for, or see in any english carp water, let alone an rmc water.

however, this 'keep it real' moniker is plastered all over the place, and as much as i agree with its principle, i am sick to the back teeth of seeing it at the foot of everyones post, as if it is unfinished without the three little words.

there will come a saturation point, and the 'keep it real' slogan will be dismissed as anglers merely jumping on the bandwagon (and i fear there is already an element of that on this website).

that is my opinion...it's not 100% positive, but life would be boring if we all shared exactly the same views.

keeping it real? as real as i see necessary...
bazza

Dan
21-01-2001, 20:46
Bazza, i can see where you are coming from mate, and although sometimes it can be annoying when "keepin it real" is plastered all over angling lines but the more people who are keepin it real the better!! im not gonna go into one explaining why i feel so strongly about it because we have all heard it one too many times, but the more true bitish carpers out there then surely the better!!

cheers
Dan

scorpio
21-01-2001, 20:55
A very good point Alex, but it is down to the fishery owners to divulge if they are importing fish and stocking them into their waters, if they don't and it is discovered that they are they only have themselves to blame for their loss of business. Don't you agree Alex?

Tony

loki
21-01-2001, 22:13
Do you really think that the small (but well intentioned) minority of 'keep it British' anglers boycotting a fishery stocked with huge imported carp would bankrupt the owner?
Please! I suggest the majority of carp anglers in this country would flock to a venue where large, easy to hook carp could be caught (not easy to catch because presumably they are not used to being reeled in on a regular basis, recognised as Fred, Jane, Brian, etc., and would therefore fight like hell).

Please understand that I agree with the view expressed in this forum, but unless there is legislation to prevent the importing of fish for health risk reasons (not restricted to carp presumably), commercial supply and demand logic will always triumph over well intentioned sentiment (the angling press being a good example).

A solution would be for all fisheries to declare their stocking policy, so that any individual could decide to fish or boycott depending on their own personal view. The only issue I'm not decided on is the question of the British record.

Chippy
21-01-2001, 22:23
If fishery owners are stocking new fish into a lake don't they need some sort of documentation, if they come from this country surely the EA have to 'sign off' on it or something, anyone know? Ian?
And if something, anything comes in from abroad it has to have paper work.I know this as I used to drive a wagon abroad and it all had documents. So unless these people are bringing them in to the country in the boot of there car then they must go through a freight terminal (even in a Transit). Surely this must be a way of tracking down the culprits as all the paperwork has to have a destination, and we all know a few.
Surely if the EA or other regulating bodies turned up at the lakes in question with a photo of fish from any publication and said I want to see the papers on this fish which we know to be in your lake then they would come un-stuck sooner or later.Hope that all made sense.
Is there any such body that can ask for (proof of purchace) so to speak?

Yappi
21-01-2001, 22:38
I support keeping it real because I cant stand all these blokes holding up 50s in magazines not caring where they came from or what may have happened to them on their journey or even that they are ruining it for other anglers.
They all send their pictures to every magazine going picking up prizes from tackle dealers every week ahead of people who have real English catches.
I hate fishery owners greed and how they dont care how many fish die in the back of a lorry as long as they get their fish and their money. Thats what really bugs me, the amount of carp that die when they are illegally imported because people dont even have enough respect to give them a good tank and dont really care how many die as long as they can get a few 40s in their lake.
It is also tampering with nature, if a certain venue containing around 26 40s was the right environment for this then it would have had that many 40s and 50s in it already and fish wouldnt need to be imported.
I fully agree with keeping it real and us keepers of reality need to come together before the situation gets worse.
What exactly is this thing on the 26th of april? Any details please?
There needs to be something that us, the every day anglers can do to help apart from not catching frenchies any ideas?
Keep it very very very real, no hump backs and no garlick1

Smarts
21-01-2001, 23:05
I have to say that I agree with Yappi's comment that if a water was able to, or had the ecological balance to hold a number of 40's or above...............then it would!



Smarts

sam
22-01-2001, 08:58
what about welsh carp? they are just as foriegn as french fish, i mean they have their own language and that? (the welsh, *not* the carp)

whilst we are on the subject, what about northern fish? do they count too? its nearer to france than it is to yorkshire for me.

british record? keep it colne valley!

;-)

**sam**

mike
22-01-2001, 11:55
This argument is wearing thin now. First of all Jim, by saying "Keep responses positive" I take it that means "don't disagree I'm not interested in your opinion unless you agree with me!". Hardly constructive!

I think Ian gave a realistic veiw point earlier. Carp without the correct papers/licence etc should be stopped from coming in. But just as in football, imports with the correct "Work Permit" can only benefit our angling and our sport. I agreee they shouldn't stand as records, but apart from that they should be allowed to provide us with many years of pleasure.

scorpio
22-01-2001, 13:09
I have to disagree with the comment of being ignorant, I for one would not sit on a bank for weeks to catch one fish, I am not a dedicated Carp angler BUT, my comment on fish being green was the fact that if a fish is imported and stocked into a water it will be greener than the fish already in there..... this does also go for fish that have been moved between waters for obvious reasons.

The point I was trying to make was a comparison between RMC (this is the RMC site) carp, and I mean large carp and the carp that are being stocked into lakes that are imported.

You can't tell me that a 45lb carp that has been resident in a lake for say 10 years is just as easy as a fish that has recently been stocked. Maybe I am not too good at getting my point across but I hope you now understand that it is not ignorence on my part probably my lack of knowledge of carp angling.

To sum this up...... there should be a law with imported fish now this will probably seem ignorant as well... why don't the fish get tagged? When a licence is issued tag the fish then there is no arguament where the fish has come from. As for the illegal import of fish from France or where ever this will continue because it is easy money for the fishery owners and very cheap advertising for their water.

Tony

mike
22-01-2001, 13:53
I never said that - that was the posting below!!

I agree with you 110%.

scorpio
22-01-2001, 14:18
Fisherman,

I do understand your point and I did state I am not a dedicated Carp angler, I surely would not sit it out for weeks on end to catch a named fish. I am what some would call a "pleasure Angler". Personnaly speaking I wouldn't fish for imports. I would sooner fish a river and catch a wild fish, no matter what the size. I am also not interested in large known carp.

As I quoted, "ANY" fish newly introduced into a water, be it carp, trout, bream..... is "greener" than the resident fish in that water.

In my opinion what we are claiming here is it is more rewarding to catch a fish introduced to a water when young opposed to catching a fish recently stocked at a large weight.

If fisheries want to stock large imported fish it is their choice and the individuals choice if they want to fish for them. As long as it is done "LEGALLY".

Regarding fishing in France, I totally agree with you... it is not easy fishing if you fish a large known lake, it may be easier than the Yately Car Park lake etc. as the fish will not be wised up to the baits being used and the fish stocks are a lot higher.

On the other side of the coin I have fished in france for carp and had 17 Carp in 5 hours all on sweetcorn. This lake was a farm lake owned by a friend of mine and hadn't been seriously fished before. This was another factor when I made my comment, I invisaged if I imported these carp into a British water they would be easy to catch as they were easy in their own environment.

I am not insulted by your comments or upset in anyway. This is what the Forum is for. Put people right if in your opinion they are wrong. Make interesting comments on your beliefs.

I for one read your comments with interest as they are structured and you have put a lot of thought into them before posting them.

This debate can go on for days, years even and the bottom line is down to the individual. If an angler desires to fish for imported carp it does not make him a lesser angler than others. It is his choice and he should not be talked down. "BUT" also he should divulge that the fish he caught was an import if he knowingly knew it was and not try to claim any records. If this case does arise and I am sure it will I think the British record should remain as it is and not displaced by an imported fish from where ever.

Tony

Stoney
22-01-2001, 14:50
Talking of flying the flag have a gander at our website www.stoneyandfriends.co.uk front page

stoney

mike
22-01-2001, 15:05
That's OK. don't worry about it!

Chippy
22-01-2001, 18:47
Thanks for the reply Ian, I can only hope in the future that something will change in the law alowing fisheries to be audited or inspected by the relevent authority as happens with most money making businesses which would maybe make people think twice about aquiring fish from dubious origins.
And as for people funding trips for 'anglers' to go across and steal fish for there own lakes they should be ashamed of themselves, both the so called anglers and the backers of the trips, how could anyone call themselves lovers of the sport when they are putting fish they are wanting to catch in the future through an ordeal like that.You are indeed spot on when you say these people don't care how many have died or sufferd so they can have there trophy shot.Sad just sad!!!
Keep it real, Ian Bates.

NODDY
22-01-2001, 19:13
HI SCORPIO.
RE THIS KEEP IT REAL DEBATE, I SPENT 3 HOURS SITTING IN THE HOSPITAL TODAY(ACCIDENT AT WORK) AND WHILE I WAS SITTING THERE I THOUGHT ABOUT THIS ISSUE AND TRIED TO WORK OUT WHY I FISH THE WATERS I FISH AND CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT IT IS NOT ONLY THE FISH THEY CONTAIN (HAVE FOUND OUT THAT NO IMPORTS HAVE BEEN STOCKED).
AND HAVE COME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT WHAT ALSO COUNTS FOR A LOT IS THE FACILITYS THAT ARE AVALIBLE. AS I TAKE MY WIFE FISHING WITH ME ALL THE TIME (I KNOW ITS SAD):),SO IT IS IMPORTANT THAT THERE IS AT LEAST TOILETS AVALIBLE.
NOW I WAS LOOKING THROUGHT THE AVALIBLE LAKES ON THE R.M.C. TICKETS AND I WAS INTRESTED IN HAVEING A GO AT KINGSMEAD1+2, SO I EMAILED R.M.C AND ASKED IF THERE WERE TOILETS AVALIBLE AND GOT AN EMAIL BACK PROMPTLY (GOOD SERVICE) SAYING SORRY BUT THERE ARE NO TOILETS.
NOW THE PIONT THAT I AM TRYING TO MAKE HERE IS IF THE CAMPAIN WANTS PEPOLE TO THINK ABOUT WHAT THEY ARE FISHING FOR THEN SURLY COMPANYS LIKE R.M.C SHOULD SEE ABOUT PROVIDING TOILETS AT ALL THEIR LAKES. AS A LOT OF FEMALES ARE STARTING TO FISH FOR CARP,BE IT WITH THEIR HUSBANDS OR ON THEIR OWN.
AND SO GO TO LAKES THAT HAVE TOILETS RATHER THAN GO BEHIND A BUSH AND TAKE THE RISK OF SOMEONE CATCHING THEM IN A UNLADY LIKE POSE.
THIS IS NOT A DIG AT IAN OR R.M.C. BUT JUST A TRAIN OF THOUGHT.

ian
22-01-2001, 19:30
mr fisherman ,you say eggo's is one of the problems and that those that catch keep it real fish feel that, the fish they catch wont be seen to be as good as it was before ,the imports arrived ,rubbish ,name me one top and i mean top angler that fishes for imported big fish ,having spent a week fishing next to a bloke who fishes for big imported carp ,and had caught 3 30+ and a 45+ in 2 months fishing the lake , having been carp fishing 2 years he struggled to catch on what is a very easy lake , i did half the time he did and had 4 times more fish , if people like terry hearn , dave lane , dave mallin , fished a well know import lake they would empty it ,at the end of the day you pays your money you fish the waters you wan't ,aslong as you enjoy your self thats all that matters i don't care, me i just go fishing to enjoy myself

bazza
22-01-2001, 20:05
i personally wouldn't have thought this 'keep it real' movement (urgh!) will suffer too much due to a lack of facilities, but i can see your point.

it is an unfortunate fact of life that venues such as kingsmead (large, open lakes with few regular anglers and public access) are visited by bored locals with nothing better to do with their time. this means that most nice things that you try and do to improve the venue and facilities are either burnt, sunk or nicked. horton has the facilities, but there is always someone there. yateley south lake has a portaloo (i think it is still there), but has very regular visits from the bailiffs due to the nature of the water (day-ticket).

maybe we will see toilets at kingsmead in the future, but until then you will still have to dig those holes!

jimshelley
22-01-2001, 21:11
hi mate,
respect ,a very top geezer with loads of cred.
marys coming to get you steve ,you know it to be true.
jim shelley
keeping it british.

NODDY
22-01-2001, 21:22
HI BAZZA.
I THINK THAT THIS KEEP IT REAL THING WILL BE AFFECTED BY THE LACK OF SUCH THINGS AS TOILETS NOT BEING AVALIBLE.
IF WHAT I SAY IS WRONG LET ME SAY SORRY IN ADVANCE SO HERE GOES.
IT SEEMS TO ME THAT R.M.C ANGLING ARE HEADING THE "KEEP IT REAL CAMPAIN" TO SWAY ANGLERS TO FISH FOR BRITISH FISH LIKE THEY STOCK INTO THEIR LAKES.
SO TO DO THIS THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE TO COMPETE WITH OTHER COMERSIAL WATERS.CAN THEY COMPETE AT THE MOMENT WITH SIZE OF FISH AVALIBLE TO ALL ANGLERS AND NOT JUST THE ONES THAT CAN AFORD TO PAY TO FISH HORTON E.C.T.
GOING BY THE IMPORTS IN THE MAGS I WOULD SAY THE ANSWER IS NO.
SO CAN R.M.C COMPETE ON FACILITYS AT THEIR LAKES I WOULD SAY NO TO THIS ALSO.
THIS IS NOT A DIG AT IAN OR R.M.C OR THE KEEP IT REAL BOYS.
IT JUST SEEMS THAT UNLESS THE KEEP IT REAL CAMPAIN AND THE FISHERIES THAT SUPPORT THEM CAN OFFER THE RUN OF THE MILL CARPER THE SAME AS THE BAD FISHERIES THEN THE KEEP IT REAL CAMPAIN WILL ONLY EVER MEAN ANYTHING TO THE COMMITED FEW,AND TO SUCSSEED IT WILL HAVE TO APPEAL TO THE MASS OF CARPERS.
BUT TO ALL PAST AND PREASANT THAT HAVE CAUGHT THE LIKES OF MARY OR HER MATE,BAZIL,BLACK SCALE, TO NAME BUT A FEW THANKS FOR GIVING ME AND OTHERS THE CHANCE TO SEE THEM IF ONLY IN A PICTURE.

alex
22-01-2001, 21:41
I still don't see the problem with imports apart from disease if you don't like them don't fish the waters like I said before carp were not native to our country the way some people talk about British fish you would think there had been in this country since the start of time.
Alex.
PS. Am I the only one who does not see this as a positive thing.

Chippy
22-01-2001, 21:41
All this talk about fisheries providing this facility and that only goes to show that these lakes full of imports need something else to draw anglers to fish them, offering the holiday package if you like. Personally I couldn't care what a lake has by the side of it, it's the fish in the water that are important to me.
If you want the holiday package, then go on holiday!!!
Keep it real, keep the French fish in France.

Yappi
22-01-2001, 22:13
Alex if I was to ask you why you are going to start fishing yately Im sure one of your answers would be to fish for big old English fish. Good thats what everyone on Rmc wants to do. Thats what keeping it real is all about. Would you like it if someone else took charge of rmc and decided to fill the match lake up with 25 40s, 50 30s and loads of other fish all imports. How would you feel then. If we dont support keeping it real then this could quite easily happen and even your favourite waters could get affected.
Or how would everyone feel if some bloke came from a lake full of imports to fish somewhere like yately and spreaded a disease caught from the other lake that could almost wipe out the lakes population of carp?
With more and more of these waters about its only a matter of time if we arent careful.
I really cant understand who would say illegally importing carp is ok when so many carp die a slow painful death in the back of a lorry because of some greedy s*d wanting 10 50s in his 5 acre lake.
Ill tell everyone about something I read on another site and some of you might have seen this before.
I heard that on this lorry that they were importing carp in they had the screws holding the tanks lid on going inside the tank. Because of this and due to the fact that the tank was so crowded every time the lorry hit a little rut or bump in the road, the carp would be pushed onto the screws and get poked and stabbed. Many fish have died this way and if anyone has noticed a certain big common in a certain lake that has red sore all over it thats the reason, there are also lots of other fish like that.
We are the ones who need to help stop this the general angler.
KEEP IT REAL,

CarponlineEditor
22-01-2001, 22:25
Can I ask a question that is sort of to do with this topic? If we had our way and the imports stopped happening which I must admit is quite unlikely as from what I have heard they quite often happen illegally, what would you do with those carp that are already here? Would you make the waters that they are in non fishing venues? Would you have them sent back to where they came from, if you knew that is? Or god forbid would you have them culled as they are a risk to our natural stocks?

I know this is at a tangent to the topic but I just suddenly thought about it and wondered what would happen to them if there was a resolution to this foreign import question.

Andy

scorpio
22-01-2001, 23:13
I would personally use them as brood fish, as we have already mentioned a Carp that is introduced into this country as a young carp can be called British. It is the same as a person born here has a British Passport no difference. It isn't the fact that these fish are Foreign, it's the fact that they are introduced into our waters at a large size from what I can see. So, let's not get all British Bulldog patriotic let's look at the real issue. All Carp in this country are imports okay, not a native species so therefore in my opinion if RMC or any other fishery imported say 1000 French Carp as fingerlings and introduced them into a lake these fish must be called British because they are being reared here. Now, if you all look at it in this respect this explains the keeping it real slogan a bit better than saying don't fish for imports.

"Keeping it real" should mean fish only for the carp that have been reared here, even if they are imported.

If I was a fishery owner and found a strain of carp that could easily reach 60 or even 70lbs in 10 years I would go all out to get some fry of this strain, even if they were French, Austrian or what ever... and no doubt RMC would too.

So, lets keep thgis subject in perspective and stop tallking about imports but instead "Large imports".



Tony

loki
22-01-2001, 23:33
Question:

1. Can a 3lb imported fish carry the same health risks as a 30lb imported fish?

2. Are we able to stop the trade of imported fish, legal or illegal?

3. Does the average angler in this country really give a damn where the fish came from, so long as he can claim to have caught a "30lb + carp"?

4. What exactly are the 'keep it real' people doing about the "problem", other than talking about it?

5. What the **** has toilets got to do with it? lol

This is a great debate!

scorpio
22-01-2001, 23:36
Answers.

1. Yes, but must be imported legally and screened for disease.

2. No.

3. Depends on what you mean by an average angler, probaly a no.

4. Keeping it real in the lakes they fish, and that's all they can do.

5. We all need a dump now and again.



Tony

loki
22-01-2001, 23:48
Tony,

The size question addressed your point about "large" imports, in this case (unlike real life perhaps) size doesn't matter, all imports are a risk unless properly screened.

If we can't do anything about it I suggest we can only lobby our own clubs/societies to resist the temptation.

Average angler probably representing 80% of the community, therefore sufficient to keep an unscrupulous fishery owner in business.

But the stocking policy of any given lake is not within the control of the people that fish it, given the previous point to be anywhere near accurate.

No further comment on the toilet issue!

Andy

Dan
23-01-2001, 00:03
I reckon that the lakes in question should be named & shamed!! at least then us anglers would know where these french pigs are, and could stay well away..

cheers
Dan

CarponlineEditor
23-01-2001, 10:42
I think possibly that the posts that were mentioning those who are 'names' for want of a better word were meaning those that are prominant in the carp magazines and the press. For example if Fred, as an example name, is shown holding a huge fish, which is known by others to be an imported fish, in the media then those who read this would obviously assume that these better known anglers are condoning the imports.

I dont neccessarily think that has anything to do with egos as such, maybe those of the anglers who write about such things in articles and have pictures of these foreigners to enhance their articles egos are to do with it but i dont think that those who question these anglers ethics egos have anything to do with it. But I may be wrong.

I think that, along the same lines as has been mentioned before that there are rightly or wrongly, those who wish to fish for 'real carp' and have a nice time and those who just wish to go fishing, have a nice time and they dont even think about where the fish they are trying to catch come from.

I did try to explain this before. There are an awful lot of anglers who really dont know much about carping. Some of them have all the gear but dont even know how to tie a hook on properly until someone shows them how. I have actually seen this happen. A chap on a lake I used to fish had run after run and each one came off. It turned out that when we looked at his end tackle after one of these losses that his knot had come undone. Now the point here is that if you have lots of anglers who don't care aboutr leaving litter, dont really know about fish welfare, dont even know sometimes how to use their tackle properly and even if you find it in your heart to try to help them, they tell you to bog off or worse because they think you are interfering in things that have nothing to do with anyone except them then what hope have you got of trying to tempt these types away from waters that contain lots of big carp that are imported from somewhere in europe or further afield.

Unfortunately I dont think that you will be able to change these anglers ways. It is a shame but it is their right too.

Andy

Charlie
23-01-2001, 13:50
Agree with all you real anglers.

Keep it RMC.

Sim0n
23-01-2001, 14:41
I think, while sitting on the fence with splinters up me arse, see both sides of the argument. I myself prefer to fish low stocked 'difficult' waters, and the satisfaction I personally get from catching a fish from this type of water is second to none. I also like to catch fish, and have waters that I fish just to get a bend in the rod.

'Fisherman' has made some very valid points, and his points about ego's are very true I think.

A question - How would you compare a capture of a 30lb+ carp from say the Craypool, and a 30lb+ carp from a vastly overstocked/and or undersized dayticket water with a 100% English stocking?
My own opinion is that they may both be meritous captures, but are in a totally different class and I would feel cheated if a Craypool capture was not deemed to be of a higher merit than the day ticket 30. (this is the ego scenario that fisherman' describes). We each deal with this our own ways.

All us fishermen are different, and are satisfied by different aspects of out sport, some people may not have the time to spend on a difficult water, and are just out to catch a fish therefore the highly stocked, undersized, overpriced water, is their best option, as is I'm sure a season ticket on a certain Dartford water is much cheaper than a week's fishing in France!

I therefore feel that this is the same argument, and the same feeling is generated with the 'English' versus 'foreign' debate. Unfortunately I feel the damage has been done, and we have to deal with it......the foreign imports are in a totally different class (below the rest).

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Sim0n on 23/01/01 06:01 PM.</FONT></P>

G_CHILD
23-01-2001, 15:02
Good call sim0n -as long as there people out there more than happy to fish for a carp that they know are imports then greedy lake owners will stock there lakes with em,its all a crock of sh**e really,i think we should all feel lucky that some people actually do care and that we have lakes with pure english big boys in em,cuz the way things are going there aint gonna be many left.
keep it large and local
G_CHILD

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by CarponlineEditor on 23/01/01 04:24 PM.</FONT></P>

ian
23-01-2001, 19:34
mr fisherman , the point i made with the bloke i out fished was this , it must be easer to catch big fish in a 9 arcer lake that contians 10-15+ 40,s alot of 30+ and afew 50+ that have been fished for for 3-4 years only, be they from england or abroad maybe in 10 years the lake will be alot harder and so catching one of the bigges will be seen as a good capture,one to respect . when carp talk splashed across the cover a fish ounces under the record ,that has been in the lake for 3 years ,they are saying its on par with someone catching mary after 3 years of trying , now i know its up to the indivisual where he fishes , but i dont belive a comparision can be made ,intresting when it came to carp angle of the year, carp talk only put anglers that keep it real ,
who are the top carp angles you ask 1, look in the old threads theres one about the best capture of the yearthers alot in there all keep it real, 2 walk round darenth take note because theres none there and no im not a top carp angle ,i just fish for 30+ fish that dont all look the same and have been swiming around there lakes 5 times longer than the imports have .

NODDY
23-01-2001, 19:42
hi dan_c.
i agree with you inthat if i caught a 60lb import i too would not send a photo to the mags, but there is the rub if some one was to send in a picture of a 60lb import and some one else was to send in a photo of a well known old historic carp what one would the mags publish and in what order would the historic carp be on the first page????.

after all is said and done the people who publish the mags know more about carp history than most carpers and could do a lot by say putting photos of historic carp in the first pages and photos of large imports in the pages after (if you see what i mean).

as for the "keep it real" thing i must be honest and say i am still sitting on the fence.(keep it british) might have been a better name. i still am haveing trouble getting by head around the "real bit", you see one of the waters if fish is horseshoe but while i am sitting there cold and wet and some one else is fishing darenth and he is cold and wet , is my discomporet more real than his????.

also another thing that concerns me is that carping seams to be splitting into a lot of different camps we seam to have four groups in carping now.
1 the "big names"
2 the "carp society"
3 the "s.a.s." of carping (b.c.s.g) to most.i have typed this while on my knees in homage.
4 the "keep it real" boys
5 and the soon to be e.c.l.a.
and all this splitting into camps as it were,cant be good for carp fishing as a whole,can it.
must get off the fence soon as it is starting to hurt.

SAMR
23-01-2001, 20:11
I'm not trying to stir of anything, but what would happen is someone dumped a dubious carp into an RMC lake?
Keeping it real
Sam

alex
23-01-2001, 20:11
There is a reason I'm going to Yateley and it is not to catch a English fish but to catch a big fish and if some one else took over and stocked the lakes with imports I would still fish there because it has been a personnal target to go fish Yateley and nothing is going to stand in my way. I love carp no matter if they are imports of English and thats the way I will always think.
Alex.

SAMR
23-01-2001, 20:18
I'm not having a go at all alex,
but i just wouldn't feel rewarded in catching a foriegn fish. It would feel like cheating and i would feel gutted if i was fishing a lake that i thought was a british carp fishery and someone came round and told me that there were imports in the lake.
Thats just what i think though
Keep it real
Sam

alex
23-01-2001, 20:25
don't worry I did not find it offensive at all that is a good point but somtimes when you've been sat on the bank all weekend and not had a single take and you then get an import is it not better than nothing.
Alex.

scorpio
24-01-2001, 07:59
Alex mate, this is the most rediculous post you have posted.... Anglers go to Yately to catch fish, yes, but it's because it is a challenge and it is a British fish water. Not because it is a famous place and called "Yately". Why don't you go and fish Darenth if you want a big fish?

Tony

jumpseat
24-01-2001, 12:42
Dear "Mr. Fisherman"

Seeing as you are set on mending our alleged tunnel vision on this 'keep it real' subject, is there any chance you may be willing to register your details. After all it is only fair to know who we may be talking to in such a well structured and avid debate. Don't you think!
Yours
Jumpseat

P.S. alex, you see what I mean about going and making an a**e of yourself. Nice one!!

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by jumpseat on 24/01/01 12:44 PM.</FONT></P>

scorpio
24-01-2001, 13:11
Personally Ian I think it would best kept as an open forum for all, the guests whoever they may be have contributed some excellent points on most of the boards and a lot of the people are guests first and then become members. Maybe if you put a limit of the number of posts a guest can make would probably draw the line about even. Obviously you will get certain people abusing the system but that happens where ever you are.

Tony

jumpseat
24-01-2001, 13:33
With you on that one Scorpio! Perfect idea.

alex
24-01-2001, 18:42
Well I can only say they are my feelings towards fishing I'm going to Yateley because I want to catch a thirty but I don't care if the fish is an import to me a thirty is a thirty as long as I caught it in this country I am happy with it and if some of you would rather catch nothing then that is your decision. Another thing I had forgot to ask is if you caught a fish that looked like an import but is a british carp do you still feel the same way about it because I had a mirror at Twynersh which looked like a import but Paul would never put a import near his water.
Alex. PS. Remeber guys these are only my opinons so don't start just because I write what I belive you don't see me having a go at you because you don't like imports.

alex
24-01-2001, 18:45
Ian I like the idea but I think many of the others would reject the idea I would personnaly go with what most people want.
Alex.

Lofte
24-01-2001, 19:45
Alex I think that you are fishing Yatley for all the wrong reasons, and with the expectations you have you may find yourself a dissopointed lad at the end of the season. Yatley is a magnificant venue with waters and fish for all. Catching a thirty from one of these lakes would be an astonishing catch. However dont get me wrong I am not saying that you wont what I am tring to put accross is that it is renouned for it difficlties which with your current feeling may see you departing from the sport (Not Good)

Boo
24-01-2001, 20:09
I agree with you entirely Scorpio. Guests should be welcome to post on the site as it makes for a more varied set of opinions. If Ian feels that there should be some control, then some sort of limit on the number of posts, pre registration, may be the best way forward. I agree that it is good to be able to identify those who are putting up the posts rather than their being totally anonymous but it is not that important to me personally.

paulh
24-01-2001, 20:25
Having just read Tim Paisley's editorial in this weeks carp-talk,
he has more or less summed up my views on the matter.
Do you not think that we should urge the record commitee to make a separate record list for these foreign imports so that if the english/britsh fish still get the accolade they deserve, but also at the same time the imports assuming they r legal imports r seen to be what they are.
That being big fish still worthy of respect BUT NOT british
This is just a thought, and maybe if we do this both patries of carpers will be happy.It might also be worth doing in case the record commitee decide to drop carp from the listings as theyve done with catfish.

cheers paul

scorpio
25-01-2001, 03:33
A british record has to be a British fish surely? We dont illegally import athletes or any other sports persons for record purposes do we. I think that the fish imported should have a place yes but not in the "BRITISH" record books.

Alex, I was not having a go at you, just your comments, you say that you fish Yately because you want to catch a thirty but don't care if it's an import? If I had that attitude I would fish a water where I had more chance of catching a 30 and it wouldn't be Yately that's for sure. Obviously Alex if you caught a 30 from Yately best of luck to you mate, you just seem to be a bit contradictive in your comments.

Tony

miller
25-01-2001, 11:59
Dan C,
am i mis-reading your last post?
I thought the original issue with imports was the risk of the spread of disease.
How would your idea combat that then?

Miller.

CarponlineEditor
25-01-2001, 14:56
I thought that these sportsmen etc got passports because they were either born over here or their parents, grandparents etc are british. Does that mean that really all of the carp are foreigners because I reckon that an awful lot of them done have british ancestors if you go back far enough. lol

jumpseat
25-01-2001, 17:10
Dear Mr. Fisherman

While I am forced to respect your 'current' right to anonymity, I do find your attitude a little strange. After all I would find it very strange having the sort of discuusion catalogued on this thread with someone whose name I didn't know!! It stands to reason that if you wish your voice to be heard and accepted, then people need to know who that voice belongs to, no? I can only assume that it would be dangerous in some way financiallly, reputation wise etc etc... for you to reveal your true identity to us. If this is the case........you naughty, naughty boy Fisherman. There you go that wasn't so bad was it! Being anonymous can only guarantee you one thing................eventual dis-interest by the very people you seek to enlighten. Happy hunting ghostman.

jumpseat

P.S. It isn't even that I necessarily disagree with you on all or any of your points of view. The fact remains however that if the 'keep it real' boys don't draw together and strike firmly and promptly the Yateley scenario could be a realistic future for our wonderful sport. Anyway must stop I am going 'leney' chasing now. I'll fire up the laptop later to eagerly read your response!! I know that at the very least it will be eloquent and beautifully worded!

Sam_Bale
25-01-2001, 17:58
No, I reckon its better as it is if people want to remain anonymous thats up to them, when I go to S&M sites I rarely use my real name and the people on there think fishing is weird!

CarponlineEditor
25-01-2001, 18:07
Hmmmm I think I have to agree with Mr Fisherman on one point here, that being the bit where he says we shouldnt have a pop at people who fish waters such as Darenth. An angler who wishes to fish somewhere that is stocked with fish that have come from abroad should not have anyone telling him or her that they cant do that. It is a bit like saying to someone who fishes for roach on a renowned carp water being called a Noddy or somesuch name, this is not on either.

I dont think I have fished anywhere that has been stocked with foreign fish and I dont think that I would want to but, if I lived in an area that didnt have any waters near enough to fish in my normal manner of short morning sessions because of my kids then if the only water I could fish because of distance was one stocked with foreign fish then I would have to fish there rather than give up completely. What I am getting at is that there are some of us that may not have many options but to fish somewhere like Darenth. The younger ones amongst us may not have their own transport or someone to take them to another water, should they be ridiculed because they fish a water with foreigners in?

Or, lol, here we go again. If someone is quite happy fishing a heavily stocked water that holds lots of doubles, then would we have a pop at them because they wouldnt be happy fishing somewhere huge with a low stocking of carp? I just wonder how far we should go in telling others what to do.

The anger about this debate shouldnt be aimed at the anglers but at those who introduce foreign fish into their waters. Even this is difficult as if you owned your own water and you legally (I say Legally here) plopped a load of foreign fish into your lake, would you like being told off for doing it? I bet most of you would say that it is your lake so you can do what you like with it as youve done nothing illegal.

For those who introduce fish illegally that is another matter and they should be publically named etc so that they wont do it again. Apparently the fines are not huge for this crime and the perpetrators would just go out and do it again if the money is there for them to do it. I spose that those who they sell there fish to should also be named publicly so that they also would not buy fish from them again.

So anyway I think that those who do the illegal sections should be hassled not those who just want to create a legal fishery or those who just want to go and enjoy a session fishing, wherever they wish to fish.

Andy

alex
25-01-2001, 18:20
The reason I set my target at thirty is not because I think I will catch one but it is something to aim for and as for me quitting the sport not likly I have come close only once and that was because of papercourt but I continued and look where I am now I just say that it does not bother me if the fish is an import all right if I caught a thirty I would like it to be British it seems most of you find it weired that I like import fish not because they are big but because it is something I have never caught and I would like to catch one I'm heading out to France this year to see what the fish are like out there I expect once I have had an import I won't want to see another one on the bank in this country but untill then I am not bothered. I now how hard Yateley is I have spoken with lots of people who have fished the lakes but I have been brought up on hard waters so I know what to expect thats why since the summer I have been planning every thing.
Alex.
PS. Tony I'm sorry mate I was not trying to say you had a go at me sorry for the misunderstanding.

scorpio
25-01-2001, 23:01
Sorry Alex, but if you go to France and catch a British 30 that would be an import. An import is not a native foreign fish, it is a foreign fish stocked into our waters. By all means go to France, I do, and fish for carp there. Those carp you catch will be French, yes, but not imports.

It's okay Alex I kow your logic it's just sometimes your phrasing seems a bit wrong.

I gather what you are saying is that you would be over the moon catching a 30.... be it an import or British but more over the moon if it was British. I feel the same mate. I do hope that you do well at Yately because you will be able to say you have caught a British 30 and loose no respect from anyone.

It is a shame things are what they are and Fishermans comments are spot on when he says that there is no way that people should look down at anglers fishing for imports because at the end of the day it is their choice.

Tony

scorpio
25-01-2001, 23:04
Agreed on the Zola Budd afair Ian, as for the football thing British teams do have foreign players but that is because they are better than the British...... with fish it is different as you know.

The point I was trying to make is we don't need a fish to be imported to gain a British record and as you know foreign people cannot claim a British record and foreign football players cannot play for England. etc. etc

Tony

alex
26-01-2001, 19:27
I think you might have misunderstood what I said Tony when I said I was going to france to catch a french carp I was not talking about imports at the time I was saying it is a target mine and so is catching an import but there is no way these fish should be allowed as record fish they are a bit of fun but when people start claiming records with them it is not right and the same for catfish that is the main reason why I am behind you guys on this one.
Alex.
Cheers for the support Tony and Fisherman you should never look down at an angler no matter what they fish for.

Yappi
26-01-2001, 23:43
Alex, you say fishing for an import will be fun. Do You think its fun for the fish while they are stuck in the back of a lorry in a little cramped tank with little or no oxygen where a lot of them die from all sorts of things from stress, getting cut up by the screws in the tanks, running out of oxygen or even by the people who import them if they find out that the deal is off and have nothing to do with the fish.
Great fun aint it!
Why cant anyone show some consideration for the fish. Believe me many many carp die in the back of a lorry and nobody ever seems to take any notice.
Alex, how can you say that you are going to Yately to catch a thirty if you dont even care whether it is English french or whatever. For me and everyone else (most people anyway) what makes Yately so special is the quality of the fish and the history and atmosphere of the water. If I caught old original fish from the match no matter what size it would mean more to me than if I caught all the 50s in Darenth. Thats what Yatelys all about. (and big fish!)
If someone went and dumped a few french 30s and 40s in Yately I know you wouldnt see anyone left that fishes there now ( does that make sense? I hope so!)

Keep It English

alex
27-01-2001, 16:27
With that kind of attuide I hope I run in to you around Yately and then maybe I could teach you and many others about respect because I'm getting very fed up with people like you have you not heard of something called personnal opinon (does it make sense now I hope so) if every one was like you I would not want to fish Yately any way. But I'm not going to let you put me off of fishing at Yately. You say about consideration for the fish but you hate imports and would not fish for them and how about some consideration for other anglers opinons have you heard of that one. I think you need to cool down and stop having a go at others I do belive that is what you said to me once.
Alex.

Alex and the rest of you youngsters please get back in your prams and stop spitting out your dummies.It's getting tiresome trawling through your squabbles every day.Please all agree to disagree on certain subjects and stop thinking every post is a personal insult.Everyone has different idears and opinions.
Now unless you want me to come round and smack your legs and stop you going out to play QUIT IT.
All go to Yateley enjoy your fishing sit down and have a cup of tea together you never know you might actually like each other.
Neil Wayte Moderator.
(Old and still learning and willing to listen to advice)


<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Rivercarper on 29/01/01 06:58 PM.</FONT></P>

Dan
27-01-2001, 19:46
chill people, for fk sake!! supposed to be having a debate, not starting rucks!!

scorpio
28-01-2001, 00:33
Agreed Dan, no conflicts please lads. Everyone has their opinions and if someone wants to fish for whatever it is down to them. keep it friendly /images/forum/icons/smile.gif

Tony

Yappi
28-01-2001, 16:22
Alex, I think you misunderstood when I said about making sense I was talking about if what I was saying sounded stupid cos I didnt quite know how to put it.
You are right about opinion, and I gave my opinion. Youre the one who doesnt seem to like what others have to say because youre getting all stroppy for no reason while everyones just trying to have a descent conversation.
I dont actually dislike french carp and I dont dislike the illegal imports its not their faults they were taken out of their home and brought over here. I will quite happily fish for them in France.
I wasnt having a dig at you anyway and I dont want to put you off going to Yately but I think youll find that the general feeling around there is that most people there wouldnt be too happy if it was stocked with frenchies.

Ps Neil we arent babies in prams and Im not squabbling so please dont kick my leg!

Keep it friendly
Yappi

alex
28-01-2001, 19:41
I think we should contiune this over the private messages becuse what you have just said is totaly wrong so don't think you were in the right what you said was a dig at me because it was addressed to me so think before you click on the reply button if you do have any more to say you know where you can mail me.
PS. If thats you having a conversation mate I would hate to see you in when you are having a dig and another question why did you have a go at me to start with.
Alex.

scorpio
28-01-2001, 19:46
Good move Alex, if you two have any differences in opinion sort it out privately

Tony

miller
29-01-2001, 16:21
Blimey.....just flicked through this one.......getting very heated.
Lots of people shouting on about Yately,
Well, just for your info it's actually spelt YATELEY.
That's better, needed to get that off my chest.

CarponlineEditor
29-01-2001, 18:50
Bugs you 'everything' you see it Chris?? lol Blimey spelling's going nuts today.

Andy

jimshelley
29-01-2001, 18:54
hi chris,
we're only carp anglers as you know ,i cant spell to save my life ,but iam trying.
tight lines
jim shelley
keeping it british.E.C.H.O".

Rivercarper
29-01-2001, 18:57
Hi Chris
Same as Jim illiterate carp angler.Much the same as the old saying"I can't read or write but I can sure drive a tractor"
or should it be
"I can't read or write but I can sure chuck a lead"

Rivercarper
29-01-2001, 19:01
I've been back and corrected my spelling mistake now Chris so do I still have to do my lines.

Yappi
29-01-2001, 19:12
Blimey its turned into a spelling competition!
Anyway back to the subject, Jim since you started this topic off, what are your views on it now and your views on the echo? do you think it will be succesful? I personally think it would be more succesful if it were open to the public so more people can join, giving it even more funds and power.
Nuff respect to chilly and co for this one its about time somebody spoke up for what they believed in!

Ps Alex did you get my private?

alex
29-01-2001, 20:49
Sorry for the spelling mistake guys due to the situation at the time I was typing too fast if you check the other post I have spelt it right every time.
Alex.

jimshelley
29-01-2001, 20:54
YAPPI ME OLD MATE,
iam very sorry mate iam keeping alot of my views to myself at the moment ,apart from iam totally behind chilli and the rest of the boys "meaning the movement E.C.H.O."please dont draw me in until chilli has set his agenda .
cheers
jim shelley
keeping it british,"e.c.h.o.".
ps .chilli will reveal all at the end of april "hopefully".

Yappi
29-01-2001, 21:31
Dont know if you remember me Chris but you were in the tackle box in kent once about nearly a year ago, signing copys of a century of carp fishing with Tim P.
I remember chatting to you about Yateley and you spoke very highly of the place.
Do youu ever still go there and if not are you ever thinking of going there again seeing as you like it so much? It would be nice to see you pulling a few lovely old fish out of there again.
Ps thanks for all the support you give rmc venues like Yateley in carp talk Keepin it Real!



<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by CarponlineEditor on 29/01/01 09:57 PM.</FONT></P>

loki
29-01-2001, 21:31
Isn't it nit picking, or summit like that!

I wouldn't do it tho! lol

SAMR
30-01-2001, 18:16
Chris
Do you still fish the manor up in oxford?
Keeping it real
Sam

jimrawcliffe
30-01-2001, 21:25
Blimey Balls on line.
Hello Ball. Nice to see you entering the fray!
Perhaps you can remind me. Have I caught any English fish?
What are Carp? Do they have udders and long horns? It comes with age you know. Yes of course you do!
So long me beauty
Rawcliffe
PS Hi there SA and JS

jimshelley
04-02-2001, 14:36
hi steve,
wots super gold 50 mate.??
jim shelley
keeping it real ,marys mate,"E.C.H.O."
PS .OR IS IT SECRET STUFF.

BWG
07-02-2001, 15:25
Hello RMC,and Jim,
What you have to remember at the end of the day is that its not the fishes fault! The fault lies with the people who import these large carp and the fishery owners who choose to by them.. The poor carp dont have a choice where they end up and it is a shame that some of these very large carp end up in tiny ponds, having been used to massive resivoirs. We must stand united against such people and as we say "keep it real and BRITISH" Long live the leney. Ben G. Priory Fisheries

BWG
07-02-2001, 15:33
SORRY GUYS IM REPEATING MY SELF,MUST BE THE LARGER. HOPE YOU GET WHAT IM TRYING TO SAY. ANYWAY IVE GOT 10,000 BRITISH LENEY MIRRORS TO GRADE. KEEP IT REAL. LONG LIVE THE LENEY. BEN G. PRIORY.

CarponlineEditor
07-02-2001, 16:34
Hmmm well the only thing that I will add to this is that if we hadnt introduced any fish from abroad then Dick Walkers record and the fifty from Redmire would not have got in the record books as they were both imported.

Andy

DanTheMan
07-02-2001, 17:11
andy - be careful mate -you are gonna open that big can of worms again buddy! /images/forum/icons/laugh.gif /images/forum/icons/laugh.gif/images/forum/icons/smile.gif/images/forum/icons/wink.gif/images/forum/icons/wink.gif
tight lines
Dan The man

jimshelley
07-02-2001, 18:23
hi ben,
nice to see you out and about,hope to see you up the big pond next season .them little boys you gave me to put in my tank are looking pukka.tight lines.
jim shelley
keeping it real"E.C.H.O.".

CarponlineEditor
07-02-2001, 18:42
lol Well you know me, i love to sit on the fence and hide my opinions. I agree that all illegal imports are bad but I am still not sure that just because a fish was imported at say five inches it is british but if it was imported at fifteen pounds it is foreign. I just cant see how you can differenciate between the two.

Most of us know that some fish grow really quickly and others take quite a while to pour on the weight so if you decide that anything over ten pounds for example is foreign but anything under isnt then you will end up with some fish that are much younger than others being labelled foreigners whereas the ones stocked at an older age would be british and I dont seem to be able to get that one into my head somehow.

Basically I agree though that british carp are a much better idea than imported foreign ones. I just cant see how you can tell which should be which.

Andy

scorpio
07-02-2001, 21:15
Andy,

A definition of a British Carp...... A carp bred here, a carp introduced here as a youngster.

A definition of an imported carp........ A carp brought here already grown up. We know that all carp were originalyy imported, it is not a native fish but and a big but, any carp that has been imported here ans a fingerling and grows to 60lb is a British fish because it was stocked here in it's infancy

Tony

paulh
07-02-2001, 21:23
Fair enough answer.
But how can you be sure these "fingerlings" arent diseased.
Surely best to keep it totally British ,there's plenty of suppliers here now.
/images/forum/icons/cool.gif /images/forum/icons/cool.gif
paul

Gnome
07-02-2001, 22:31
Hi All.
I feel it's about time I had my two penny worth on this subect, as I've sat on the fence long enough. Reading what has been said on this and other forums, and in the angling press, it is rather evident that feelings are running high to say the least. Unfortunately a lot of people have highlighted the problem, but I havn't read many ideas as to how to solve it. Except for naming and shaming, oh and maybe some burning at the stake. lol. So for what it's worth here are some ramblings from an average, run of the mill, fishing for fun, semi-specialist angler.
OK I feel that naming and shaming would leave one open to some very hostile remarks, to say the least. So how is a mere mortal like me going to find out what waters have foreign imports in them?
Obviously R.M.C. have made their position very clear. And I would imagine that (all) Club Waters are import free, but I could be very wrong on this one.
It also seems to me that there are many anglers out there that are happy to fish for LEGAL Imports, and I think that I might be one of them, "if given the chance". But along with almost everyone else I DON'T WANT TO KNOW ABOUT THE SMUGGELD FISH. So again how do we find out and eradicate the problem?
Well here are a few ideas that may, or may not work, given time. Like all living things, these fish have a life expectancy of "x" years. So without without the need for any other means, they will eventually expire from old age. In the meantime it will need for fishery owners to go public, and say whether they have imports or not. We can then safely assume that the fish we are fishing for are legal (no one in there right mind are going to claim they have an import in their lake, if illegally stocked). By doing this it leaves it up to the conscience of the individual as to where and for what he fishes. OK there will still be some fish illegally imported, but if as everyone says, that this practice should be banned. Then everyone will be fishing waters that hold just English Bred or Leagal Imports. Thus eventually removing the need and temptations to import illegally. But it will take time.
Now onto the problem of claiming records and suchlike. All legally imported fish above a certain weight (be it 20, 30, 40, 50lb) should be Tagged or Marked in some way. Easily Identifiable to the angler. Thus proclaiming to all, "I'm a bona fide fish, living happily in your waters, with my passport all in order". Now wether you ban these fish from holding a record or not, is a different debate. Personally I would like to see them recognised, but for what they are "foreiners", but not taking away from the anglers skill's to put them on the bank.
So just to recap:- All fishery owners to come clean and state wether or not they have large LEGAL IMPORTS in their waters. Magazine editors to encourage reports from openly disclosed waters. All new Large Legal Imports to be humanely Tagged or Marked, before introduction to their new home, by an authorised body, so they can be readily identifiable. The Record Fish Committee to either include or exclude or set up a seperate list for LEGAL IMPORTS.
OK, so I'm sure that there are some flaws in my reasoning, big enough to drive a bus load of of imports through, and I'm sure that somebody out there will see them and point them out. But we've got to start somewhere, getting hot under the collar and shouting about it will not make it go away. We have got to come up with some answers, and stick to them. Obviously I don't know what SACG, The Carp Society or 'Chilly's' ideas are to combat the situation. All I know is that we need to unite behind One Banner and provide a UNITED FRONT, not to stamp out the foreign imports. BUT TO STAMP OUT THE ILLEGAL FOREIGN IMPORTS.
Right that's me about done. I've had my say, but please there is no need to slag anyone off. After all angling is a personal thing, and if Mr."X" wants to fish for Legal Foreigners then that's fine by me. It's got to be his choice. In closing I must say thanks to "Chilly" and everyone else whose thoughts I've read on the subject. You all have certainly made me stop and think about where I am coming from. And if I am lucky enough to be invited, I would be proud to be part of ECHO and support all it is trying to achieve. But there agian I supose I already am.

Trying to keep it British,
Trying to keep sane.
Gnome

The Gnome.

scorpio
07-02-2001, 22:54
Very good gnome mate, the only thing is that the fisheries need free advertising, if a record fish is caught it needs to be recognised as a record to give the said fishery a "name". This is the major problem, it all boils down to money.

No way can a fish be *imported* legally or illegally and be called a British recond in any form. It is not a british *reared* fish. You can't have Made in Britain stamped on a product if it is made elsewhere. I think the people in comtrol of the recods should have a way of being able to identify these impots as you say, this won't single out the ones already here. I have nothing against who fishes for what, I will be wholeheartedly against any angler who catches a potential record knowing it is foreign and trying to claim the record though. There is a difference here........

Tony

scorpio
07-02-2001, 23:00
I was referring to fish already here Paul, for example Mary, Basil and the likes........ their ancestors are not British....... Now as you say we do not need to import fingerlings as we can get them here..... The difference is our climate does not support growth of Carp like our foreign friends so their carp will be bigger than ours..... hense the illegal importing of *large* carp. I can see the Carp world going like the Trout world did, controlled environments in heated tanks feeding patterns to obtain large fish, Now that is a can of worms... I won't press this issue but will have my say. Would you be happy to catch a 60lb *british fish* artificially reared in a tank and stocked into a water at 60lb? This is the carp angling of the future.

Tony

BWG
08-02-2001, 08:45
HI EVERYONE, Well its clear that we dont need fingerlings as there is a glut of small carp in this country, i can tell you that as i have 50,000 + sat out side ready to sell!!!! We just need to get the message across to fishery owners to be patient and think to the future. Grow your own. (thats carp not the other) this topic could go on for ever, we lust need to be united and be able to make or own choice, as there will always be a demand for ilegal imports and legal , its been going on for years and from the grapevine we often hear of very large sums of money changing hands so it goes on. Money and greed. Keep it real keep it British and long live the leney. Ben Priory Fisheries.

BWG
08-02-2001, 08:50
Jim , Hows things on the fen? any joy lately. Will be back on the big pond this year hopefully break my run of bad luck from last year ie tackle stolen etc. After the captain pug wash i presume mr Shelley. Keep it real. Keep it in your trousers. Ben priory.

jimshelley
08-02-2001, 19:35
hi ben,
you are a top angler with limited time to fish ,respect to you mate ,you know it to be true .the why forward is wot you "PRIORY fisheries and RMC angling are doing with a little help from SIMON.why dont fishery managers and anglers who want to be mega rich and mega stars in angling ,just wait for the proper boys"carp" to grow into our history.
instead of being an instant big fish anglers on instant waters containing instant big fish.GOD THAT CAME FROM THE HEART.
JIM SHELLEY
KEEPING IT BRITISH."e.c.h.o.".

BACON
08-02-2001, 20:09
Can't fault what you're saying mate but some people want the limelight at any cost despite the consequences to the Carp be they home bred or imported.
All comes down to greed really on the part of the importers, the fishery owners & in some cases (don't wanna tar all anglers with the same brush) the greed of the angler.
KEEP IT REAL MATE

BACON

scorpio
08-02-2001, 22:17
You will find that the anglers looking for limelight are being sposered by big companies ** aledgedly**. It has all happened before in the trout world, a massive rainbow stocked, the lake closed, a camera team and executives from a * large tackle company* present, one angler *well known* fishing and the Angling press there too..... 2 hours later the British Record rainbow trout goes, the angling press pay for the photograph rights, the fishery gets instant recognition, the angler is branded a hero and the tackle company get the rights to say the angler was using their tackle.... all this in 3 hours.... please. This is what will happen to Carp Angling. The fishery then puts up it's day ticked to £70 a day for 4 fish.... sad.

Tony

jimshelley
08-02-2001, 22:29
hi tony,
theres no way iam going down that road ,thats for loosers ,who aint going no where.
jim shelley
keeping it real"E.C.H.O.".

scorpio
08-02-2001, 23:15
This I am totally aware of, it is obvious there are guys who love their fishing like our Jim & Co.these guys are highly respected and also on the other side of the coin there are Guys who reap benefits any which way they can, I could mention some but as we know this all has to be above board here.... to be honest it is common knowledge. I was not directing my findings to *all* well known anglers only to those who exploit angling to gain what they can from it.. If I can dig out that article regarding the trout fishing I will mail it to you.

Tony

jimshelley
08-02-2001, 23:29
scorpio,
got some whites if you want some mate .
jim shelley
keeping it british,"E.C.H.O.".

scorpio
08-02-2001, 23:31
Love some matey but I can't drink the strong stuff, my job don't allow it but thanx for the offer /images/forum/icons/smile.gif

Tony

BWG
09-02-2001, 09:01
Morning to all at RMC hello Jim and Rob Fletcher,
Thanks Jim you bought tears ro my eyes with that heart felt token on the last page. Keep up the good work and keep those whackers coming. Enough back patting.

We are always here for people who want to hand pick there future stock, ref: Vivs January diary, Gobby and Lucky were both hand picked, one from the Sutton stock and one from our farm. We had a chap here yesterday who hand picked 28 mirrors and commons, these fish will be the future for his fishery! This is the kind of fishery management we need to enable our true British carp fisheries to continue. I know that Ian is very much in that stable, and will keep up this type of work for the furure. Its the only way. K.I.R BEN. PRIORY

Dan
09-02-2001, 18:30
no need to get your nickers in a twist littlej, all cash was saying was "respect" if its jon coxhead, which is what jon coxhead deserves, class angler..

alex
09-02-2001, 18:51
What is it like for you guys I mean people must treat you like a celebrity when they see you walking around lakes.
I would hate to have that sort of thing I don't mind the odd person come up to me and ask for tips and things.
Alex.

jimshelley
09-02-2001, 18:57
hi,
mr lane sorry but are you the proper dave lane i know ???
jim shelley
keeping it RMC"E.C.H.O.".

scorpio
09-02-2001, 19:35
Do you mean filter tips?

Tony

ian
09-02-2001, 21:30
this is why carp fishing is the only sport where anyone can particapate next to there hero's from that sport , you can hold the same fish caught by , jim , terry, rod , richi mac ,laney and so on no other sport can give you that

Sim0n
10-02-2001, 20:52
hmmm...tongue in cheek response??

paulh
12-02-2001, 14:22
I think a list of ,English carp venues would be a good idea but as you say quite tricky to set up.
A roll of honours venue would be more positive than a name and shame list.And probably less likely open to libel/slander cases that might occur if a venue was wrongly placed on a shame list.However the venues would have to prove beyond doubt their credibility.
</font color=red>keep </font color=white>it </font color=blue>British
/images/forum/icons/cool.gif /images/forum/icons/cool.gif
paulh