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manhattan63
15-11-2010, 20:55
I'm planning a fishery, a LONG way to go and I have one of those fisheries management consultant-type people onboard, who I'm sure will have plenty of advice.

But to pass the time while my bones are defrosting...

What would you stock in a lake of around 13 acres if you had the chance? Nothing in there to start. Chucking in 30s or even 20s is a non-starter. I want to stock smaller fish and let them grow on. It's never going to be a day-ticket water so whatever is in there shouldn't ever be under too much stress. It probably won't get fished at all for several years after completion.

A chance to have a special lake further down the line, but how would you stock it to start with?

carper946
15-11-2010, 20:58
100 or so 5lb fish. Fast growers like dinks would be good.

hardtail
15-11-2010, 21:07
200 5lbs priory carp and several years worth of conditioner feed and pellet and just thin then out if needed as you go

curriemuncher
15-11-2010, 21:10
depends what sort of fishery you want if a carp fishery spend time choosing your stock wisely buy from guys that are committed to producing quality carp with good strong genetics vs fisheries are a very well recommended company also most good carp suppliers will offer advice to you on these sort of subjects especially if they care like simon and viv at vs do, if it was me personally i would start of with a light stocking say 50 fish and then make top up stocking every year or every couple of years antil you think you have a good stock level i.e low stock or high stock fishery

carpmanjay
15-11-2010, 21:37
depends what sort of fishery you want if a carp fishery spend time choosing your stock wisely buy from guys that are committed to producing quality carp with good strong genetics vs fisheries are a very well recommended company also most good carp suppliers will offer advice to you on these sort of subjects especially if they care like simon and viv at vs do, if it was me personally i would start of with a light stocking say 50 fish and then make top up stocking every year or every couple of years antil you think you have a good stock level i.e low stock or high stock fishery

that's exactly what I would do. A light stocking of quality carp at that size. See how they get on. Then add a few hand picked fish every year until you are happy with your fishery.

Dapper
15-11-2010, 22:05
I often kill time thinking of this!

If I win the lottery and do similar....would get a 13 - 15 acre lake with lots of features, bays, islands and expanse of water (North lake woul be ideal!)

4 Fish an acre, about 50 fish, of prime Viv Shears stunners, Dinton warriors, some Sutton Fish and even a smattering of good looking Simmo's....(I quite like some of them, particularly the original ones like the IOW fish)

Would then include Gudgeon (always wanted the record) Golden Rudd, Crucians, a few Tench and some golden orfe.

Lovely.

dolly
15-11-2010, 22:16
30-40 fish tops would be my ideal to a max of 12-15lb when stocked, of a medium growth rate with stunning looks, vsfisheries would be ideal or fish of similar looks and proportions i,e suttons

carpmanjay
15-11-2010, 22:16
Another guy on my Xmas card list !

donkey choker
15-11-2010, 22:18
Keep the biomass at no more than 150lb an acre, netting out excess fish each year to retain the 150lb limit and you will find they will grow quite nicely. Remember the biomass also includes all the other fish and invertebrates so some estimation will be required.

DC

CARP_ANGLER
15-11-2010, 22:43
As some have mentioned, stocking 3 summer fish around the 4-5lb bracket is what i'd do given the chance! In the right environment young fish with good pedigree that size will pack on weight!

I know of a fishery who stocked some fish averaging 4lbs and some into doubles both from the same supplier...! The single figure fish outgrew the larger older fish in time! When they wanted to top up the stock, they went for the C3's!

As has been suggested by others, for the long term, Id recommend starting off with a light stocking and topping up every few years or so, that way they're not stocking fish of all the same year class, so you have some continuation as others get older!

Only down side in doing this and bringing other fish onto the site after your initial stocking, is the risk of bringing diseases in, hence why many fish farms are reluctant to bring in any other fish on site once they are fully operational! Having said that if you purchase from a reputable farm the risks will be minimised! IMO

Sounds to me your going about it the right way, wish you all the best with your venture!!

manhattan63
15-11-2010, 22:57
appreciate the replies guys.

Are there benefits to netting and reducing stock further down the line? It was something that has been mentioned to me, but I presumed (quite possibly wrongly) that this was for financial reasons. Beyond finances is it good practice to *over*-stock and then reduce or just stock low initially. I imagined that as few a stockings as possible would be better, so not sure we'd have further stockings beyond an initial one or 2, but I'm still learning and happy to sponge as much free info as possible :thumbs:

Dan_H
16-11-2010, 00:04
I know sod all about fishery management but how about having a stock pond on site so you could grow your own on, and in time and add a them a little more safely in the future?

For proper stocking advice I would speak to a few people in the know and get some professional advice but as this is just forum chat it don't hurt to get an idea.

Personally I would not want more then 100 Carp in 12 acres and then that would only be that many if the bio-diversity was capable of accommodating that many fish.

I would also like to have a fair amount of other species to supplement the stock.

kenmundo
16-11-2010, 00:44
Was recently looking at this for a friend as he was looking at buying an empty 3 acre lake. I know nothing about Fishery management but its a fun game to play. The cat fish were because thats what he loves so no berrating me about the slugs. Prices are there as well.


Carp
Mark Simmonds special 4 summers carp
12 per pound – 12lber = 144
10 x 12bers = 1440

Vs Fisheries 5 summer carp
15 per pound – 18lber =270
5 x 18lbers = 1350

Pike
Mark simmonds
5 per pound – 6lber = 30
5 x 6lbers = 150

Bream
8.50 per pound – 5lber = 42.50
5 x 5lbers = 212.50

Tench
Priory fisheries
15 per lb – 4lber = 60
5 x 4lbers = 300

Catfish
Humberside fisheries
26 per lb – 15lber = 390
10 x 15lber = 3900

Roach
8 – 10inch 100 = 250


Total
40 fish + 100 roach
7602.5

Cyprinius
16-11-2010, 08:10
From a personal point of view, I'd make a point of sourcing the stock from different backgrounds. Some fisheries have some stunning, scaley fish (ie: Horseshoe), but one scaley one after another can be a bit 'samey'. Contrast that with a fishery like Savay, where you never know what's coming out next, be it a fat old Italian type, or a lovely long fighting machine.

If you've got the luxury of designing and building your own fishery, it would be advantageous to build a seperate, small isolation / stock pond next to your main lake. That way you could have any new fish isolated from your main stock for a period so you can monitor them for any problems, perhaps introducing just one of your existing fish prior to stocking into your main lake. That way you minimise the risk of introducing disease.

Sounds like an awesome project. Very best of luck.

Cooperman
16-11-2010, 10:23
4 fish per acre is what im planning for my lake, 3 different strains to keep them interesting. suplimentry feeding during the winter, to keep their condition and weights at their peak.

Then you have to sit back and wait a couple of years for the results to show through.

Personally im going for Dinton strain and Lower Berryfield fisheries strain carp. Great scale patterns and great growth rates too.

HarryAlun
16-11-2010, 12:41
4 fish per acre is what im planning for my lake, 3 different strains to keep them interesting. suplimentry feeding during the winter, to keep their condition and weights at their peak.

Then you have to sit back and wait a couple of years for the results to show through.

Personally im going for Dinton strain and Lower Berryfield fisheries strain carp. Great scale patterns and great growth rates too.

Sounds bang on, maybe a few less fish and it would be perfect

Cooperman
16-11-2010, 14:15
natural thinning out of the stock will mean it will end up with 3 fish per acre, thats what im basing my calculations one.

HarryAlun
16-11-2010, 14:19
natural thinning out of the stock will mean it will end up with 3 fish per acre, thats what im basing my calculations one.

Fair point, sounds perfect then!

How about some stunning mirrors that need a new home, as there current home in yateley is getting filled in!

baldycoot
16-11-2010, 18:53
I'm planning a fishery, a LONG way to go and I have one of those fisheries management consultant-type people onboard, who I'm sure will have plenty of advice.

But to pass the time while my bones are defrosting...

What would you stock in a lake of around 13 acres if you had the chance? Nothing in there to start. Chucking in 30s or even 20s is a non-starter. I want to stock smaller fish and let them grow on. It's never going to be a day-ticket water so whatever is in there shouldn't ever be under too much stress. It probably won't get fished at all for several years after completion.

A chance to have a special lake further down the line, but how would you stock it to start with?

10 carp
800 bream
6000 tench
one for the hardcore
oh and only one rod no nights

common
16-11-2010, 20:13
Leney dinks from Neil Hardy, anything scaley from Viv and Simon and plenty of thought about who, when, why and for what.

Good luck.

Dapper
17-11-2010, 14:29
4 fish per acre is what im planning for my lake, 3 different strains to keep them interesting. suplimentry feeding during the winter, to keep their condition and weights at their peak.

Then you have to sit back and wait a couple of years for the results to show through.

Personally im going for Dinton strain and Lower Berryfield fisheries strain carp. Great scale patterns and great growth rates too.

Coops, you seem to be some way down the road of acquiring your own lake.

Whats the biggest thing / surprise you have discovered during your investigations?

I mean, im guessing like the majority on here you know about carp fishing from an anglers perspective, and haven't been and done a fishery course, so what have you learnt in your 'fisehry' investigations with the experts that have really stood out.

For example, im surprised at 150lb and acre comment, seemed a bit high to me, but breaking it down thats only 4 x 30lb fish and some silvers / tench.

You learn something new everyday.

Cooperman
17-11-2010, 15:40
I have almost everything sorted now, just need a pond to get started on. That's the most suprising thing, the lack of availability of lakes, i have made about 50 enquiries to various lake owners and they all seem to be holding out for housing development (even though most of them are located in flood plains), i have not even got as far as talking money with them, they say they are not interested in selling, end of.

Other than that, it all seems reasonably straight forward, the problems seem to arrise from greed, overstocking of the lake, will lead to oxygen issues, that leads to the need for chemicals and tree cutting etc.

Im basing my projects on the old skool Yateley stocking policy, low stock means low maintainence and low risk. I never saw any issues at Yateley until they started loading up the lakes with lots of carp, before those days, nature did the work, bailiff's picked up the litter and checked tickets.

gc1
18-11-2010, 10:39
Sound's like it's going to be a great place to wet a line mate, good to see your on top of it.

Roo
18-11-2010, 11:14
still missing trhe point then coops? there never was a problem until the lakes matured and the nutrification and silting started.
As the lakes were young and had smaller younger stock there never would have been any issues with DO, Nutrification, silt ingress and available diffusion area.
20 years down the line and all of the above is an issue and has to be managed. I know you prefer to have the enegmatic vista of an overgrown pit such as BB, Bazeley & Weatherill, Stone, Craig and Walker wrote about but you still miss the point. They were carp anglers not fishery managers; it takes a great deal more management then you seem to think.
Do some more reading mate, you may find it useful!

chubba
18-11-2010, 11:24
There is a two acre lake for sale near Chelmsford along with some land for 75K! Tad expensive IMO but looks nice!

Roo
18-11-2010, 11:28
perfect Cooperman can go put three fish into it and call it a low stocked oober exclusive syndicate and retire from the profits LOL :D

gc1
18-11-2010, 12:05
There is a two acre lake for sale near Chelmsford along with some land for 75K! Tad expensive IMO but looks nice!

Id say! think coop's will need to sell a bit more bait yet:lol:

chubba
18-11-2010, 12:12
Would have been a nice little plot to build a house on though!

Private Syndicate for friends and named anglers only. Fill it in with Choc Orange till they hit 60 and then boast in Carp Talk!! :thumbs:

Who wants little Johnny no bait deal fishing near them anyway!

Seriously though just offer a farmer some $$$ to lease his irrigation pit! Fill it with some Simmo's and chuck some bark about the place! Job done!

Roo
18-11-2010, 12:20
perfect, get some note writing done coops LOL

carpark
18-11-2010, 12:25
Would have been a nice little plot to build a house on though!

Private Syndicate for friends and named anglers only. Fill it in with Choc Orange till they hit 60 and then boast in Carp Talk!! :thumbs:

Who wants little Johnny no bait deal fishing near them anyway!

Seriously though just offer a farmer some $$$ to lease his irrigation pit! Fill it with some Simmo's and chuck some bark about the place! Job done!

i cant understand sum fisherys and the people who fish them sumtimes,
the go about filling lakes with simmos and croats ect ( the owners)
then the anglers fishing for them say number dont matter to them :confused:

ide rather catch a old warrior wat was a single figure fish
than a wrong un that is 7 year old and weighs 30plus its just wrong:suspect:

manhattan63
18-11-2010, 14:09
It's like someone has put down a bait bucket in my thread :thumbs:

Humbers
18-11-2010, 14:18
i cant understand sum fisherys and the people who fish them sumtimes,
the go about filling lakes with simmos and croats ect ( the owners)
then the anglers fishing for them say number dont matter to them :confused:



Why would you want to stock Eastern Europeans in a lake?

carpark
18-11-2010, 14:24
Why would you want to stock Eastern Europeans in a lake?

thats wot i was trying to say then the members fishing for them saying fishing got nothing to do with numbers ryteo y fish for them then ??? y stock them ?? and boast about having several 30s n 40s wot are ugly and all look the same then next sentence " its nothing to do with numbers is it tho mate " get a grip wrong uns

Humbers
18-11-2010, 14:26
thats wot i was trying to say then the members fishing for them saying fishing got nothing to do with numbers ryteo y fish for them then ??? y stock them ?? and boast about having several 30s n 40s wot are ugly and all look the same then next sentence " its nothing to do with numbers is it tho mate " get a grip wrong uns

Bear with me I'm just going to log on to babblefish.com

carpark
18-11-2010, 14:56
Bear with me I'm just going to log on to babblefish.com

sorry not posh enough for u essex bunch :bonk:

Greenfish
18-11-2010, 16:09
thats wot i was trying to say then the members fishing for them saying fishing got nothing to do with numbers ryteo y fish for them then ??? y stock them ?? and boast about having several 30s n 40s wot are ugly and all look the same then next sentence " its nothing to do with numbers is it tho mate " get a grip wrong uns

How many stellas have you had? :bonk:

carpark
18-11-2010, 16:18
How many stellas have you had? :bonk:

:lol: not stellas made just sum quality hemp free p+p 2:thumbs:

Blonde_Tim
18-11-2010, 16:21
sorry not posh enough for u essex bunch :bonk:

didnt realise hampshire was in essex.....

carpark
18-11-2010, 16:24
:brick: :brick: not particularly familiar with the south any further down the a1 than nottingham ime lost:brick:

armalites
18-11-2010, 16:46
It is the kind of thing we all dream about.

Been doing the maths myself as I have a few acres and a fresh water spring pumping out of 4 inch pipe 365 days a year presently going into a stream.

It is interesting the varying numbers of fish per acre given.

The problem is an acre is a measurement of area and not volume. So 1 acre at 4 foot deep is obviously 1/3 of the water of an acre at 12 foot deep so the fish per acre theory is immediately floored.

4 fish per acre in a lake with an average depth of 12 foot you'd hardly ever see a fish especially if there is a lot of natural food. That may well be part of the appeal.

Places like Wraysbury or Sonning have much lower levels of fish than that but that is why people have fished years for one or two fish.

I guess it all comes down to if the place needs to pay its way or if you can afford to have it as your own playground.

Cooperman
18-11-2010, 18:23
Roo, what's rubbed you up the wrong way. I am only stating the facts as they were. the need for a multi-national company to make more and more profits, to do this they stock more fish per acre. It's not rocket science that they need more space, if not there is the potential for problems.

I don't see that the issues with the disolved oxygen were bought about by the lakes aging in just 3 years, i see it as something to do with the much larger biomass of fish, the ones that were stocked 3 years before the first fish kill. But, as i don't have any formal qualifications, then i will bow to your greater knowledge. (Not sarcasm by the way).

Im not sure why you have taken it so personally? as i didn;t think you were involved in the events i was reffering to? but again, im sure there is a chance im wrong on this too.

As it is, my plans for my lake (when it eventually happens), will be for a low stock water, not a huge profit making exercise, somewhere between a playgound and a business, but leaning towards a life long ambition to try and achieve. To do this, i will need advice from qualified people like yourself to reach its full potential.

manhattan63
18-11-2010, 22:21
For my development there is no pressure for the place to bring in an income.

BUT... if there are to be people using the lake and paying for the privilege, then it would be run as a business. It might be a syndicate or something small scale, but it's either a landscape feature or a business, there's no middle ground.



Roo, what's rubbed you up the wrong way. I am only stating the facts as they were. the need for a multi-national company to make more and more profits, to do this they stock more fish per acre. It's not rocket science that they need more space, if not there is the potential for problems.

I don't see that the issues with the disolved oxygen were bought about by the lakes aging in just 3 years, i see it as something to do with the much larger biomass of fish, the ones that were stocked 3 years before the first fish kill. But, as i don't have any formal qualifications, then i will bow to your greater knowledge. (Not sarcasm by the way).

Im not sure why you have taken it so personally? as i didn;t think you were involved in the events i was reffering to? but again, im sure there is a chance im wrong on this too.

As it is, my plans for my lake (when it eventually happens), will be for a low stock water, not a huge profit making exercise, somewhere between a playgound and a business, but leaning towards a life long ambition to try and achieve. To do this, i will need advice from qualified people like yourself to reach its full potential.

Stratfink
18-11-2010, 22:34
42.50, forty two pounds and 50 English pence for a 5lb bream?! You've got to be ****ting me! I'm in the wrong job! This time next year Rodney we'll be millionaires!

Bream_Boy
22-11-2010, 12:57
When I think of the other things you can get for 40 bream do seem very expensive.